River of Words Oral History Project: Bill Steen, "Vortex," "Alhombra" and the Politics of Class in Historic Districting

On February 15th I met with Bill Streen. His words are "vortex" and "alhombra." In our discussion he brought up the fraught politics of historic districting, notably, the class exclusions that can occur. He reflected: "My wife and I signed a petition to not have the expansion of the district. I think all districts are historic and while I—because its city of asylum and river of words and its Guiselda and Carolina and Hector and Rafael—I hope they’re successful because it’s a positive thing, but there’s also a sort of irony, and maybe the less generous side of me says, “if they don’t get the commission or whatever to approve keeping the words maybe they’ve been hoisted on their own petard” and I don’t know, again, I think there was a lot of people within the historic district that were pushing for the expansion of it, which I think makes it difficult. I feel the historic district makes it difficult for people of certain socioeconomic levels to remain in place...

I’ve termed the expansion of the historic district “Redlining by Other Means” and it would be kind of ironic for people who, yes, the River of Words are a wonderful thing, but it would be ironic that say somebody within the historic district that doesn’t have the economic wherewithal at the time to make a much needed renovation to their home that would fit the very strict standards, if they weren’t able to do that, that a certain class of people was able to get the rules changed to do this, to keep the words on, and to me, that seems very unfair and – but like I say I’m conflicted because it’s a wonderful project, but I hope the people within the district who want the words to remain on their houses will think more about what expanding a historic district would mean to certain people who aren’t as fortunate."

Thanks, Bill.

Transcript follows.

CB: Okay. I am here with Bill Steen as part of the River of Words Oral History Project. Thanks for being here.

BS: I am glad to be here.

CB: I’m going to start with some demographic stuff, one of the things I’m interested in is getting a sense of the diversity of the participants. If you can provide your age, address, race or ethnicity and marital status.

BS: I am 56 years of age. I live at 1322 Arch Street in Pittsburgh, so I live two blocks from here. Marital status, I’m married to Susan. What was the other?

CB: Race or ethnicity that you identify as.

BS: Call me Caucasian, I guess.

CB: How long have you lived in the Northside?

BS: We moved to our present address in July of 2008. So over 6 years.

CB: Are you a Pittsburgh native or do you come from somewhere else?

BS: I was born in New York City.

CB: Cool, what part?

BS: Queens.

CB: Cool, I’m from Inwood in Upper Manhattan. And so does your house fall within the historic district?

BS: IT doesn’t. It falls just outside. It was in the area that people were trying to incorporate into, which I am happy they didn’t.

CB: And we’ll talk a little more about that later. Lets turn to the River of Words project. Can you tell me, first of all, what is your word? And how did you get involved, and all that?

BS: Okay. We actually have two words. One is “vortex” and the other is “alhombra”—

CB: How do you spell that?

BS: A-L-HOM-BA.

CB: Okay.

BS: And it’s a Spanish word from Arabic roots meaning “Pillow.”

CB: How did you choose your words?

BS: Well actually we chose “vortex”, Susan and I, at the meeting where they had the words in the tent over here. But “Alhombra” was basically, we got to know the artists, they were by one day, doing a neighbor’s word, and they said “Hey we have this extra word its getting near the end of the project, we’d like to give it to you.” At first we said “Maybe give it to someone who doesn’t have a word” but they insisted and so we said “Sure, the more the better.” Vortex is just like an applique on the window, whereas Alhombra was three dimensional they had to screw in into the brick word. And unfortunately somebody came by and pulled off the “a” so it’s been, what is it, frenchified, now “l’hombra,” unfortunately the “a” is missing now.”

CB: So almost “l’hombre” or shoulder. How did you find out about the project, initially?

BS: Well, we’ve, ever since moving into the neighborhood we’ve been big fans and supporters of City of Asylum and so naturally we get word of all their stuff, and we liked the idea, because we get all the emails, so, yeah.

CB: Over the last six months can you tell me if the meaning of the words has changed for you and what kind of impact they have had on your lives?

BS: Well, we love our words. We specifically picked “Vortex” due to the wintry weather last year and we are getting a bit of it now. We liked the idea of a polar vortex and right now we have it decorated with snowflakes behind it, but, I don’t know. Susan and I both love books, love to read, love literature, and so the idea of having a word, the whole idea behind the project was cool and just fun, in today’s society where it seems to me, though maybe I’m just being an old fogey, it seems that people read less and less and they are doing more just looking at images and stuff. It just seemed important to do.

CB: Have people asked you about your word? Have you had any memorable interactions around your word?

BS: We happened to be, there was one woman walking by the house, we happened to be out and she asked about the word so we told her about the project, but we haven’t had people like ringing the doorbell—or a lot of the. I think a lot of it is happenstance, so if you happen to be outside your house and somebody comes by and asks about it. So there was this one woman.

CB: What do you think the broader significance of this project is?

BS: Well, I think, which is a great part of City of Asylum’s mission, to keep people in touch with reading and books and literature and it feels like its just a good thing to do. It helps make the community more interesting. Its fun to go by areas that aren’t part of like this centralized Mexican War Streets, the historic district, [but also] out on Western Avenue in front of a restaurant that we go to there is a couple of words so its neat to run into houses that have these words. Its just, I just think it’s a positive thing.

CB: So I want to turn now to the Historic Review Commission controversy. I know you don’t have a historic district house [but] are you aware of what’s happening with that?

BS: I am. I got the email from Henry that talked about Glenn Olcerst, who I know, so I am aware of all that. My wife and I signed a petition to not have the expansion of the district. I think all districts are historic and while I—because its city of asylum and river of words and its Guiselda and Carolina and Hector and Rafael—I hope they’re successful because it’s a positive thing, but there’s also a sort of irony, and maybe the less generous side of me says, “if they don’t get the commission or whatever to approve keeping the words maybe they’ve been hoisted on their own petard” and I don’t know, again, I think there was a lot of people within the historic district that were pushing for the expansion of it, which I think makes it difficult. I feel the historic district makes it difficult for people of certain socioeconomic levels to remain in place.

CB: Can you say more about that?

BS: Yeah, well, I’ve termed the expansion of the historic district “Redlining by Other Means” and it would be kind of ironic for people who, yes, the River of Words are a wonderful thing, but it would be ironic that say somebody within the historic district that doesn’t have the economic wherewithal at the time to make a much needed renovation to their home that would fit the very strict standards, if they weren’t able to do that, that a certain class of people was able to get the rules changed to do this, to keep the words on, and to me, that seems very unfair and – but like I say I’m conflicted because it’s a wonderful project, but I hope the people within the district who want the words to remain on their houses will think more about what expanding a historic district would mean to certain people who aren’t as fortunate.

CB: That’s really interesting. I noticed, I went to my first historic district hearing, where Henry gave a speech, it was really interesting because the debates were about, basically, appropriateness. There were arguments made by people who wanted to make [architectural] changes for reasons of security and cost, but those kind of values were denigrated in favor of the notion of “history” or “historic appropriateness” so it is interesting to think about those issues of class. And how it relates to a historic district.

BS: My daughter is an architect and she doesn’t like the idea of historic districts. She says, I stole the phrase from her: “All districts are historic” and there is history to all things and I think it just puts a great burden on certain people. Some people it doesn’t  matter and its great, it keeps the home values up, it keeps certain people from moving in, and frankly that’s not what everybody’s in it for but there are certainly some people.

CB: that’s really interesting. OK. Can you speak a little about what you think to be the role of public art in the North Side in general?

BS: Well, I think its had a large effect on the community. I just see a number of people, you see the number of people walking around the area and they are obviously, they have made an effort to come to the area to see certain things like Randyland or the House Poems and the beautiful artwork on the houses, so I think its had a really positive effect. My wife and I often say that we cant imagine this neighborhood, the North Side, without City of Asylum and the things that City of Asylum brought to it. Specifically, public art, which we love.

CB: What is it that you do, if you don’t mind me asking?

BS: I am a special agent with the secret service.

CB: Oh wow.

BS: No jokes, please.

CB: No, no jokes. Fascinating. There was I think one more little question I wanted to ask I thought of while you were talking. No that’s it. Is there anything you’d like to share in terms of comments about the projects or anecdotes that I haven’t given you a chance to talk about?

BS: No. But other than, I just, I’d like to see them maybe do a River of Words part two. I think there would definitely be interest. I’m sure there are people who would love [to see it] expanded, doing a second [one]. I thought it was a great idea, and the artists, it was so nice meeting them.

CB: What was that like? I read a press release about synapses etc. but I wasn’t here yet.

BS: Well, we went to dinner with them, Henry and Diane invited us to a dinner with them at Café du Jour so we got to meet them and see them at events here and on the street and it was just really really nice, so yeah, I’d like to see a second, 2.0.

CB: Great. Thank you so much.

BS: You are welcome.

River of Words Oral History Project: Bette McDevitt, "Friendship" and Slippery Stones in the River

I met with Bette McDevitt on February 22, 2015. She had some interesting thoughts about future challenges to HRC, notably, the possibility that more and more neighborhoods will want to have solar panels, a clash that might make the HRC "a dinosaur." She also identified the different ways in which the non-english words in the River could be read, for her, that they were "slippery stones" that were hard to identify with. 

Thanks, Bette!

Transcript below:

CB: I’m here with Bette McDevitt and she is with me as part of the River of Words Oral History Project. Thank you for being here. I’d like to start with some demographic data, I’m trying to get a sense of the diversity of the participants. So can you please give me your full name, your address, your age, your marital status, and your race or ethnicity.

BM: OK. Bette McDevitt, 428 Lockhart Street, Pittsburgh 15212. What was next?

CB: Age?

BM: 81.

CB: Marital status.

BM: Widow.

CB: Sorry to hear that. Race or ethnicity?

BM: Caucasian, I guess.

CB: Okay. And how long have you lived in the North Side?

BM: Since 1999, so I’d say that’s close to 15 years.

CB: And how long have you lived in Pittsburgh?

BM: I’ve lived in Pittsburgh three different times and this time I’ve lived here 15 years.

CB: OK. Were you born in Pittsburgh?

BM: No, I was born in Newcastle. But I have a very strong attachment to the North Side. My great grandfather was a constable in the park, when he came from Germany, and that was a Civil War job, and my parents met in the park, and I came always to spend my summer vacations here in the North Side. Its where I belong.

CB: Do you know if your house falls within the historic district or not?

BM: It does.

CB: Ok. Lets now turn to the River of Words project. Can you tell me about how you became involved, how you decided to host  a word?

BM: yes. I was here when there were Eastern European people here with the puppets, I’m sure other people you’ve interviewed have told—

CB: I haven’t actually heard about the puppets.

BM: Well that was something going on in the tent at the time. And so there were people over on the side who, at a side table, who had these words, and I also knew that there was a Venezuelan writer here in residence and I thought it had some connection with him, but I found out later that it didn’t. but I had found out that these were Venezuelan artists, and I found out at an event at the summer tent.

CB: What is your word?

BM: My word is “friendship” which I hope to keep.

CB: how did you decide on that word?

BM: I decided on it because of the meaning in it.

CB: What does it mean to you?

BM: Well, my neighborhood, and the whole North Side has been for me a very friendly place, and friendship is what ties us all together. I would not have taken a word that I didn’t- sometimes I see the words that I guess are Venezuelan, I don’t know, I don’t know the derivation of them.

CB: So you wanted something more familiar. So six months later, what has it been like, displaying this word? How have people reacted? What are some stories that have happened because of it?

BM: Actually almost none. It fits in very well, it’s the same color as some siding on my house so it looks like it was meant to be there and its on the top of my window and maybe people are not seeing it because I’d say I’ve only had two or three comments on it, but I like it very much.

CB: What have the comments been?

BM: “Oh nice,” “where did you get that?” “why do you have it?” I have never talked to anybody about the theme of the River of Words.

CB: And has the meaning of the word changed at all for you since you’ve first installed it?

BM: No.

CB: What do you think the significance of this project is? The whole River of Words project?

BM: Uh huh. Because I live outside of this area where there are more of them, there’s only 3 or 4 people over there on my street who have the words, and I feel a connection to them and I think “Well, of course they would have a word.” But I like my neighborhood very much, I like everybody, and I think everybody would have a word if they could. But I don’t feel very connected with it to anything else in particular.

CB: So now I want to turn to the Historic Review Commission issue that has been happening—

BM: Oh!

CB: What do you think about it?

BM: I haven’t heard very much about it. Although I think ours is certainly state [historic district] because nobody can change outside the front of their house, maybe the folks here are in a national—are they having trouble about that?

CB: Yeah, so basically my understanding is that those houses within the historic district maybe weren’t supposed to put them up at all, because it is an alteration to the appearance of the building, but what Glenn Olcerst is trying to do on behalf of some neighbors is to get an exception to that rule to allow the words to stay indefinitely.  So that’s my understanding.

BM: Well, there are so few of us, I am in Allegheny East, Deutschtown, and we haven’t heard much about that. But that’s interesting because were I younger I would be putting solar panels on the front of my house because it faces south and it would be a perfect candidate and there are neighborhoods—this is going to come up—because the Heinz foundation is giving money to neighborhoods so people can install solar panels without that big outlay of money, and they are going to run into Historic Review. I thought about that, and I thought about how that makes it a dinosaur then. It makes it a dinosaur. But I also appreciate the viewpoint, a little bit. But my word fits in. its on the transom, its blue, it looks like it belongs there.

CB: What do you think the HRC should do, do you think they should grant an exemption?

BM: Oh I would think so, yeah. Are you talking federal historic review, state or local?

CB: The Pittsburgh one. I went to the hearing though and one of the fears voiced by the HRC was that if there is a local exemption made it might still have statewide or city wide impact, so that’s part of their fear. But yeah, I am not educated enough on the different patchwork quilt of historic districts. That’s another thing I am learning about. But I’d like to close with your thoughts on the role of public art in the neighborhood. So, what do you think the purpose of public art is for the North Side?

BM: Well, it gives artists a job, and that’s good. It gives them some money, which is good, because we are not very good about funding our artists. Along with gardens, it enhances the neighborhood. Are you not going to ask me about my encounter with these particular artists, is that not going to be part of it?

CB: No, please, I’d love to hear about that.

BM: Well, I didn’t feel very identified with the project, I didn’t know exactly what River of Words was, but I wanted to be a part of it if it was going on in the neighborhood. And I like that word. And so, they kept saying, they said they would come at some point within this timeframe and they came at about 9 o’clock on a Sunday evening, and it was still daylight, but I was in my nightgown and I came downstairs, it’s a townhouse, and all three of them were there who were responsible for the project and they were so nice and friendly, and we got a stepladder and they said “Oh its perfect it matches your house it looks so great!” and they were very enthusiastic so that was a very pleasant experience, but beyond that I didn’t ever have any—and sometimes I’m puzzled by the words that don’t make any sense to me that are in another language. I don’t think that’s a good river.

CB: Why don’t  you think so?

BM: They are slippery stones. You can’t connect to them. But there must have been a reason.

CB: Hm. Yeah. I talked to a gentleman who has a Spanish word that is the word for pillow, and I guess he liked the sound of it, I’ve heard other words but people kind of grow on them. So, is there anything else that you’d like to say about the River of Words or public art?

BM: You know, I put yard signs out, frequently, and no one has ever bothered me about that. Political yard signs and stuff like that.

CB: Yeah, its interesting, what gets attention and what doesn’t. Okay. Anything else you’d like to share that I haven’t given you a chance to talk about?

BM: No.  I hope I don’t have to talk mine down.

River of Words Oral History Project: Kathy Deis, "Retirement" and "Renacimiento"

I had the pleasure of meeting Kathy Deis on February 22nd. She is actually the mother of Terri Wiezoreck, and so she is responsible for that additional interview as well. Her words are "retirement" and "renacimiento" both pointing to a sense of renewal and new stories that occur as one follows life's stages. The words, she noted, were "perfect" in describing her and her husband of 54 years. Importantly, she mentions that some of the friction between the HRC and North Side residents comes from the sense that the HRC imposes regulations rather than "working with" the neighborhood: an antagonistic rather than a dialogic relationship.

Thanks so much, Kathy. Transcript follows:

CB: The date is February 22^nd and I am here with Kathy Deis as part of the River of Words Oral History Project. So, thank you so much for being here.

KD: It’s my pleasure.

CB: I wanted to start with some demographic information, I am trying to get a sense of the diversity of participants. Can you tell me your full name, your address, age, marital status, race, and I’ll remind you [of the questions] if you need reminding.

KD: My name is Kathleen Deis. I live at 1221 Buenavista Street. I’m lost already.

CB: Age?

KD: I am 72.

CB: Marital status?

KD: Married for fifty-four years this year.

CB: Congratulations. How do you identify with your race

KD: Caucasian.

CB: And how long have you lived on the North Side?

KD: This time thirteen years.

CB: And did you live on the North Side the earlier two times you were in Pittsburgh?

KD: No, we lived over in Forest Hills, on the East Side of Pittsburgh, but that was with family, kids and stuff, so we went there for schools.

CB: Okay. I see. Do you know if your house falls within the historic district?

KD: It does.

CB: Ok. So I would now like to turn to the River of Words project. I’d just like you to talk about your experience with the project. So, how did you find out about it? What was it like? How did you choose your word?

KD: So, we are big supporters of Henry, so we get regular emails, we come to a lot of the readings and events that he holds, so it was through that that we found out about it. And, then we came that one day to the tent to pick our words, and it was a very nice experience for us meeting the folks that were involved, and I think that’s what makes us so defensive of the HRC giving us grief.

CB: What was the word that you chose?

KD: We had two. We had “retirement” and the other word is Spanish, I can’t pronounce it, you probably can’t read my writing, but it means to “re start” it kind of goes with “retirement.”

CB: Oh, renacimiento lovely.

KD: So when we decided to come back to Pittsburgh this time it was goind to be our first retirement house, and then stuff happened, and we decided to finish it faster and move in even though, for the first ten years, my husband was working in New Jersey and would commute every week, back and forth.

CB: Wow. That is a lot of commuting.

KD: He loves it though, audiobooks got him through.

CB: I see. Great. So six months later, has your relationships to your words changed at all?

KD: Just more protective of them. I’m very pleased to see how many people left their words up, our daughter lives in the 1700 block of Buenavista but that’s not historic, and her words are “Be good.” And she has a six and an eight year old.

CB: Ah [laughter].

KD: Yeah.

CB: So that will change meaning as they get older as well.

KD: Yeah, but it was interesting seeing what different people chose as their words. Some went very, I don’t want to say emotional, but something very private to them and somebody else walking down the street probably saw something else.

CB: Can you tell me about any interactions that might have happened around your word, if there were any?

KD: Everybody that knows us thinks its great for us and the words were, before the house tour in September and we always have a big party that day, and we have a lot of our friends come in and started looking for them and agree, that that was us.

CB: Where are they installed on your house?

KD: We have a stone porch, but its on the window right on the porch.

CB: What do you think the significance of this project is?

KD: It gets people talking. I also take care of two big flower gardens in the neighborhood, and my title is Green Space Chair and a lot of people thought I was responsible for the words, so, once the words started being installed, then everybody wanted one. And they thought I could get them for them, but by then the people had gone back to Venezuela, run out of words, that sort of thing. So I think that since this is a series of activities, it was a good way to start, and I hope it gets more of my neighbors into protecting it.

CB: Gets more of the neighbors into protecting the words?

KD: The idea of the words. Having art. Have you talked to Barb Telerigo yet?

CB: I’m scheduled to talk to her…not yet, nope.

KD: So, their house is on the corner of Eloise and Resaca, and her husband made this large mural—

CB: Oh yeah, Glenn. I’ve talked to Glenn, I haven’t—

KD: So, it kind of started around that. You know it was his gift to the neighborhood. He was very careful how he did it, very respectful, and then HRC didn’t like the lights, didn’t like the cam- the camera was too big. In this neighborhood where everybody is putting up cameras, “his camera was too big” he was told. It was crazy.

CB: That’s a good example. Let’s turn to the HRC controversy. What do you think about it? And how did you learn about it?

KD: Well, we’ve been down at the HRC often because our house was in the historic area when it was being built so we knew them from that. We knew, when Glenn was- when people have a problem with the HRC and they are going to have a hearing they put out an email and as many of us show up as possible, and its on third Wednesday afternoon of the month, so not a lot of people can go. But there is several hard-core work from home kind of people that show up. So we do stick together on that. I think that, I’m not sure about this part, I think that the positions on the board are all voluntary but they have Sarah that’s the paid employee and she has too much…she doesn’t try to work with us, she tells us what to do. What you can and cannot do.

CB: So what do you think should be done with River Words with respect to the application filed with HRC?

KD: Well, I think the one thing that came out of the meeting before was, the simple answer is for us all to go and pay $100 and have a hearing of our own, and that’s way too much money. Glenn’s organizing a group effort. He’s a lawyer so he’s going to represent us in a class action suit and anybody who wants to can sign up with him and he will represent us.  So that was the committee itself said, that needs to be looked at. They also said “there’s no history to anything like this” so they have to come up with a whole idea of how to handle art, what is art? That’s the other discussion they tried to get into, and it kind of got nasty because someone brought up graffiti and when is it good, when is it not.

CB: I want to close with your thoughts on public art in general. What do you think the purpose of public art is in the North Side and by that I am thinking of, who does it serve? What does it produce?

KD: I love to see the kids’ reactions to things. I think that’s important. I think a lot of times our kids have been led to believe that art is not for kids, its for adults, its for people that have money, but it doesn’t have to be that. A lot of times people don’t realize some of the installations that go in downtown and that all you have to do is walk around and its right there. I’d love to see more of that kind of thing. I do know some of the people that are not for allowing public art in the Mexican War Streets, they wouldn’t appreciate art that is not museum quality. They don’t see the value. And yet they don’t recognize on that several of the telephone poles we have flags that say “Mexican War Street,” that’s a kind of art. But they don’t recognize them.

CB: Is there anything else you’d like to say that I haven’t given you a chance to talk about?

KD: No, this was very good. I wish you a lot of luck with this and it’d be interesting to see how this all turns out.

CB: yeah, absolutely.